LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!
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LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!

posted at 28/6/2009 1:48 PM BST
Total posts: 61
First post: 12/5/2009
Last post: 14/7/2009

Hi you scrummy bunch!! Tongue out

Some of you are aware of my "Wise words required" post a few weeks ago and the update! I had a few mixed responses, which I appreciated immensely as you took the time to respond.  Thank you.

Anyways.........  Contradictory to my whinging ways about falling in love and having it thrown back in my face, I have always believed that men do not make us happy - we make ourselves happy. Men were not put on this planet to complete us or fill a void.  If we meet a great man, it is simply a bonus to hopefully a generally fullfilled existence.

But on reflection, I realised that I had reacted to something that went completely against the grain.  What I mean is, I have got this total crush on my new man.  We have been together since August 2008 and up until now it was brilliant.  No pressure, no hiccups - just fun, excitement and two people who are enjoying each others company.  Until I decided I was in love and was not getting the same response from him.  In the end, I got quite insecure and eventually plucked up the guts to tell him so.  It got thrown back in my face.  He wasnt aggressive or dismissive in his response. He was angry with himself for not feeling the same way and tried his best to tell me, as gently as he could, that he fears commitment and the thought of marriage totally horrified him. He admitted that the ex-wife experience has jaded him and, until he met me, he believed that all women were potentially bitches.  I understood this as I have had my fair share of undesirable men - and why I put up with their behaviour for as long as I did, I dont know.  (That will have to be something else I will attempt to analyse one day!).

For now, I was so gobsmacked at his response (not loving me back), that I got myself completely out of control emotionally. I cried myself to sleep for about 4 days, I couldnt focus on anything or anyone else (including my children) and I was sooooo angry with him for *leading me on*.  After all, he has been kind, caring, supportive, loving and quite vocal on how he feels early on in the relationship.  And he chased me - so what was I supposed to think?

Well, the bottom line is, I thought like a WOMAN! Not realising that men just don’t think like us.  Yes, they will chase, and when they KNOW they are in love, they will be totally committed - but rules are different. Woman base their emotions on that, emotion.  Men base theirs on logic.  I got myself so wound up and miserable that, rather than drown myself in red wine and ice cream (not supposed to anyway, Im diabetic!!), I got myself Googling! And I found so much information on the "why a man wont commit/why he doesnt love me" syndrome that I taught myself a valuable lesson.  If us women remain a mystery, if we are dynamic in our own lives (own friends, own hobbies, own past-times, independant, strong and undemanding), men actually find that way more attractive than the whinging, whining, clinging, demanding, co-dependant people we can become when things dont go our way, when WE want them too.

You could say that, ah, typical woman, making the allowances, letting HIM call the shots etc but actually yes, thats exactly it.  Men are different to women and the rules are different – no matter how much we kick and stamp our feet, the rules remain the same.

I stepped back and saw myself and how I was behaving - and it wasnt pleasant.  My man has not given me any cause for concern, until I dropped the big COMMITMENT clanger! And, at the time, he ran like the wind.  He is still here but the game plan has changed.in that I need to let this man continue the chase and I need to remain the independant, confident, devil-may-care woman that attracted him in the first place.

You cannot FORCE someone to love you - and playing those whining, emotional blackmail games do not work.  Guilt mongering and tantrums only make the situation worse!

Anyway, already there are positive reactions.  Im not hanging on every word, I dont always respond immediately to his text messages, Im not always home when he rings, I don’t always cling onto his arm when we are out (just the odd little touch as I pass him when we are out with mates, etc).  Ive stopped making him the be all and end all of existence. And through this *step-back*, he is still caring, supportive, affectionate, articulate and even a little excited that Im not making him the be all, etc.

We both have the space we require and I feel so liberated and, in the process, have liberated his fears.   This has all happened in a week.

I read tons of articles online, written mainly by men.  Men who had been players most of their lives and, as they matured, realised just how unhappy lots of women were, when romantic notions grabbed them. And these men gave insights into their psyches and the pain and resentment co-dependancy puts on the female of the species.

I dont know what will happen next week, next month or next year - but by stepping back and not making our relationship the answer to everything - I can live my life without getting myself totally depressed (acting like a petulant child, which I caught myself doing!).  And if things dont work out, for whatever reason, I can hold my head up high saying I remained myself.

Thanks for taking the time to read and all comments welcome J

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic

Re: LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!

posted at 28/6/2009 2:39 PM BST
Total posts: 15459
First post: 20/1/2005
Last post: 3/11/2009
Sorry but I don't agree. People are people and you just can't make such sweeping generalisations. Mr Megs for example is far more emotional than me.

And as for this 'remaining a mystery' bollocks its quite frankly game playing. I have never tried to remain a mystery with Mr Megs, right from the start I was open and honest about who I was and what I wanted so he fell in love with me, not the person I was pretending to be.

No you can't force someone to love you, but making excuses and playing games will not end in a happy loving relationship.

From what you have posted it sounds like you want to be this independent, happy woman in order to make a man love you which kind of defeats the purpose. When you are that person you do it for you, not for a man.

If you love someone, you don't make excuses, you don't need to play games and you don't need silly rationalisations or generalisations - it's simple and easy and wonderful.

I could of course be wrong, but having been in a loving, supportive, honest and happy relationship for coming up to three years I know it works for me.

Re: LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!

posted at 28/6/2009 2:58 PM BST
Total posts: 61
First post: 12/5/2009
Last post: 14/7/2009

What is wrong with maintaining my independance and giving him time?  Im not playing games, (maybe *game plan* was the wrong word!).  I know how he feels, he is showing it every day but I cant stop his fear of committment and if it takes him longer to *know* he loves me, then so be it.  

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic

Re: LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!

posted at 28/6/2009 3:11 PM BST
Total posts: 15459
First post: 20/1/2005
Last post: 3/11/2009
Because you are doing it for him, not for you - or at least that's how it sounds. All this men think this way/women think this way is rubbish IMO.

And I don't buy the 'I cant love you because I'm scared line', it doesn't matter how hurt you have been in the past, when you meet the right person you let that fear go and take the chance. I have never heard that line used where it wasn't an excuse. And because you want to believe that deep down he does love you then you accept that.

It sounds like you have read that 'women are from venus', or 'the rules' bollocks.

If you want to give him time fine, I see no problem with that, people can and do fall in love at different times, but purposely making yourself unavailable in the hope that will help him along is game playing. It's been a year and he has said he doesn't love you - maybe you just have to take him at his word.


Re: LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!

posted at 28/6/2009 4:07 PM BST
Total posts: 6448
First post: 29/5/2005
Last post: 25/9/2009

I'm with Miss Megs on this one, you sound like you have been brainwashed like the stepford wives! Men are all different as are women. MrSlurps2B is the more emotional of the two of us and more romantic and soppy too and he knew he loved me so he proposed when it was right, no silly games, no playing hard to get , i was myself...i didnt sleep with him for a longer time than alot of people manage these days but that was just me and it worked for us. True love doesn't have to hurt  and it doesn't have to be all ups and downs and drama and tears and rows...and as for mystery, try that when you live together.

You are playing a kind of game with him whether you realise it or not. You say'' if it takes him longer to know he loves you so be it''...after a yeat nearly ,he either does or doesnt.


blog post photo 
Brewster & Holly


Re: LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!

posted at 28/6/2009 4:36 PM BST
Total posts: 17185
First post: 11/11/2005
Last post: 24/9/2009
I hate to rain on your parade but I think you're still making excuses for him and ultimately trying to behave a certain way in the hope that it might make him behave a certain way and that's wrong. 

It sounds very forced, you're doing it for him not you and I agree that it's just game playing.

If you read 'he's just not that into you', it quite categorically states that the 'I was hurt in a previous relationship/marriage so I can't commit to you' type line is just an excuse.  He's just not that into you.  The author says 'no previous marriage, no matter how bad and how bitter the divorce will prevent a man from re-marrying if he finds a woman he is truly head over heels for'.

Give him time by all means but I do think you're going down a dangerous path at the moment.

Re: LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!

posted at 28/6/2009 5:19 PM BST
Total posts: 61
First post: 12/5/2009
Last post: 14/7/2009
Ive read all your posts and I understand perfectly what you're trying to say. I suppose this is a case that I am still in the for him, not me, state.

I thought I had it sussed!

How do I explain to you that I still have faith in our relationship.  Everything else is fine - if that makes any sense?  He admitted, once I said I love you to him, that he doesnt feel the same way but sees us together forever.  He is attentive, kind, loving, affectionate, supportive.  Took me off to meet his brother (his parents were elderly and passed away within a few months of each other two years ago but said his mum and dad would have loved me!), his best friends and is willing to meet my family end of July.

Do you all truly believe I am being lead on?

Im back to confusion, girlies!! 
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic

Re: LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!

posted at 28/6/2009 5:41 PM BST
Total posts: 15459
First post: 20/1/2005
Last post: 3/11/2009
It's hard to know without being in the situation. Has he said that he is falling in love with you, but isn't there yet, or that he doesn't love you and can't see it changing?

If it's the first then yes I would give it some time, but I would also, for my own state of mind, accept that if there is no change, then I'd have to walk.

There is nothing more soul destroying than loving someone who doesn't feel the same way, even if they like you very much. It eats away at your self esteem and you end up settling for second best and hating yourself for it.

I would certainly be honest and open with him, explain that you do love him, that you at least want to know that he is getting there, no excuses, no blaming past relationships, and if he say's sorry no he doesn't feel the same way and isn't likely too, then I'd accept that and walk away with my head held high.

Just don't allow your feelings to become irrelevant and don't try to hide them in the fear it scares him off. Your feelings matter just as much as his.

Re: LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!

posted at 28/6/2009 7:52 PM BST
Total posts: 12944
First post: 29/1/2005
Last post: 10/10/2009
In Response to LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!:
Well, the bottom line is, I thought like a WOMAN! Not realising that men just don’t think like us.  Yes, they will chase, and when they KNOW they are in love, they will be totally committed - but rules are different. Woman base their emotions on that, emotion.  Men base theirs on logic. 

  Men are different to women and the rules are different – no matter how much we kick and stamp our feet, the rules remain the same.

Posted by Sigourney


Ok.. you say comments welcome...

... Well, I totally disagree with what you have written above... Not all women base their relationships on emotion and not all men base theirs on logic - I've had far more emotional partners than me and I'm very capable of detaching emotion to look at things logically..... That's not always been the case, but as I've got older and realised 'signs' in a relationship... I think I am better placed to take a step back and look at the relationship from a more subjective angle.

Rules? Bollocks - I don't stamp my feet or cry.. if I find a 'man' who thinks he has different 'rules'... then I don't date him - if I find someone who treats me with respect and believes in equality... then I'd consider him as a potential partner.

The idea that as emotional  (IE total pansy) beings, us ladies have to appreciate men are 'different' and thus we have to either pander to them, or 'understand' them more than they understand us... is.. erm.. not something I wish to contemplate.

I'd more than happy to talk about commitment and if the man runs away - then he's not the man for me.... if I want to say something... then it comes out my mouth - I don't want to 'hold back' for 3.41 months before we talk about exclusivity.... nor do I wish to consider his feelings for 2.17 months before I can discuss commitment.....

Sounds far too much thinking to me - do what you want and if he doesn't like it or treats you badly... then personally.. I'd say he's not the one for you.

Re: LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!

posted at 28/6/2009 8:50 PM BST
Total posts: 61
First post: 12/5/2009
Last post: 14/7/2009
In Response to Re: LIBERATED! Long read, sorry!!:
It's hard to know without being in the situation. Has he said that he is falling in love with you, but isn't there yet, or that he doesn't love you and can't see it changing?

As I said in my update a few days ago, a few minutes after I told him I loved him, I found he was crying silently and, on asking him what was the matter, and he said he was angry for not feeling the same.  He said he wants to let go and should feel the same.  And then he gave me this huge spiel about he never wants to commit and that he never wants to get married again, and sorry for not making that clear from the beginning.  I persevered with the communication, asking why he wouldnt consider marriage eventually and he said that if it all goes wrong, at least he cant be taken to the cleaners.  I said, I am not the ex wife I am me and he said he knows that and we left it at that.

If I can list things he has done since Ive known him. When I hurt over the loss of my mother, he holds me, caresses me and says such amazingly beautiful things to me. He spent Christmas with me and I had a horrible flu virus and he waited on me hand and foot and gave me lots of TLC. He is the one who calls round every day, he is the one who arranged a wonderful (diabetic) dinner for me on Valentine's - he took my diabetes diet book home on the sneak and cooked me a wonderful chicken dinner (the breasts fillets were heart shaped), he made his mothers recipe soup for starters and a wicked no-sugar yoghurty dessert. He has taken me to meet his brother in Edinburgh (who thinks Im the best thing since sliced bread LOL), Ive been introduced to the best friends and we see them a couple of times a week. He asks me out on trips to the beach, town, shopping and we have spent every weekend together since mid August 2008 - until last weekend when I told him I loved him and so this weekend we didnt spend it together (sleepover), altho we spent his birthday on Friday out all day, and went to his friends for a bbq.  I will admit at the point when this weekend arrived, I had started reading those articles about non-commital men and the bits about giving fearful men space stuck in my mind, so it was I who decided we shouldnt sleep over this weekend.  But I rang him and asked if he was sure about not staying and he stuck to his guns that we should not this weekend - just for some time out.  So altho I propagated it, he then stuck to it!

I cant stress how warm, kind, gentle, tactile, funny and communicative he is on mostly everything.

Its hard to think that this man doesnt actually love me - I just feel he just is afraid to make the final leap of faith.



Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic
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