My inability to understand things

Hi y'all
I have a bit of a pathetic problem, well, i dont know if i'm being weird or not, so i think i should see if anyone thinks i am being a loon - its all based on my seeming inability to understand sociability
when i was a teenager, i had a friend called K, she was a year older, very very cool and i looked up to her very much, she looked like Madonna, and was beautiful, witty and was allowed to do what she wanted. She was a bit of a bitch to me, to say the least, she did things that i put up with as i didnt know what else to do. For eg when i was 15, my bf got killed in a car crash, and K came round and the first thing she said was that hed asked her out a few weeks before so her bf hated him. Another time she lent me her clothes and did my make up before a party, at the party i heard her in a bedroom with my crush, telling him how awful i looked. She had a gorgeous bf, and my esteem was so very low that it would never ever have occurred to me that shed be jealous of me. I was talking to her bf and playing slaps with him and laughing, and i remember seeing her looking in the room and crying and running out. I didnt react at the time as it didnt cross my mind that she would be upset by this, I realised only recently that maybe shed been upset i was talking to him.
Recently she appeared on fb, and friended me. I accepted and sent her a message, saying that id realised that wed had a very unhealthy friendship, that i was sorry if id upset her when we were younger, and that shed done some stuff to me that i hoped we'd both grown out of. I never heard back off her, but she made a comment about a pic i posted so i assumed that she didnt hold any grudges but wasnt willing to talk about what happened. I got a message off her sister asking me to her 40th at the end of this month, now i know other mutual friends were invited weeks ago, so i dont think K knows im invited by her sister. Theres a lot of people i know going, and im wondering whether i should now just either write it all off, and forget these people in my past, or if i should write it off, go and make a fresh start with her and other people there. Shes now 25 years older, and prob very different to who she was then. I guess if i go and it messes up, at least i know thats a chapter i can close
Thing is, my past is littered with these sorts of friendships. I miss people from my past but at the same time, know that i was treated badly, but again, at the same time have never really made friendships again. i dont have friends really, apart from my best london friend and my best up north friend and i rarely see either of them and to a certain extent, its my choice not to have friends cos i just dont understand how to keep friends happy, how to not be pushed around or not to just fail at being a friend. i crave getting past it. Could this help me get past it, or should i just get past it and start again? I have been trying for years to start again, moving around from city to city, but i always feel groundless and like no one really knows me.
any advices?
x

Nato I would like to give you a great big hug, even though I know you'd hate it.

First of all, about your friend from school. I don't think I'm on my own in saying that sounds like a pretty typical teenage girl friendship. Teenage girls are fraught with constant envy and insecurity, I personally don't miss that time at all. I bet she had no idea how she made you feel; empathy is not a common trait at that age. She sounds like she had a massive set of her own insecurities and that motivated her way more than how she felt about you.

What would you expect to get out of going to the party - what sort of closure do you want to get? I am worried that you would get yourself wound up unnecessarily, which is the last thing you need at the moment.

It worries me that you think you don't know how to be a friend - how are you different in real life to how you are on here? On here you are funny, clever, attentive, sweet, kind and I can't think of anything else I'd look for in a friend. What has your relationship with your husband taught you about friendship? For people to get to know you properly, you have to let them. You have to show them every part of you. What is it about your two best friends that you don't think is 'transferable' to other new friends?

lots of love
x

Im gob smacked that you feel like this nato, to me you would make the perfect friend you give great advice, your never judgemental and you always seem to come across as caring.

As for your old school friend I think we've probably all been there at some point in our lives, personally I would go along to the party but I suppose at the end of the day it's what your comfortable with.

xx at ya angie
you know what, its a total revelation to me that everyone has had those experiences at school - honestly, i thought it was just me. I really did. But you both say that its stuff youve had
I thought that i specifically have problems with friendships. Just thinking that i have had problems with friendships has made me find friendships more difficult, but it might even all been my head, now i hear what you 2 have written.
i am sat here wondering if im just too touchy or sensitive and cos i thought i was alone, maybe i have had the same experiences as everyone else, but i am still being affected by them while everyone else is notbothered.com
i am a very flakey friend, i refuse to get close to people, i always find people love me at first and really want to be close to me... then when they get to know me, they start to lose respect for me - but i think to some extent thats cos i am a 'victim' because i cannot stand to be horrible to people, i let people target me if you see what i mean - and i dont know how to react to that in a way that would be considered stable, so i dont react. Even my best friend bullies me a bit. I then react by withholding my friendship, so she then is extra nice to try and overcompensate for when she knows shes gone too far and i then relent. My usual tactic is to not let people get close. Often this causes problems in itself, a girl i went to counselling with really tried to be friends with me and i didnt react the way she expected, so she got a bit sniffy with me and seemed hurt by my rejection of her clear wanting to be friends signals. Its a bloody minefield, i dont understand it.
hmm, its very unhealthy, but i just dont know how to be assertive.
how are you different in real life to how you are on here?
You know what angie, i have wondered this before. But i think how i am on here, with the lovely girls on here, is how i am at my best. Its how i am with my husband, i feel comfortable with the baggers that i know and i think that this is how id like to be, but theres very very few people i feel comfortable with, which is also why i enjoy posting cosi do feel comfortable. I am often at odds with peoples expectations, their morals and their views on life, and when im at odds, i dont know how to be. I feel like i dont fit in, in real life except with my husband who i am 100% comfortable with so i am 100% like i am on here with him. When i see my friends, i am often uncomfortable and awkward and might drink nervously or somert. Which is another reason why i thought id go to the party, cos i cant drink and am at my best when i am not drinking so if im ever going to make a good impression, its now
thanks dyno my lovely - xx at you too, i think i might go. i think im being a bit of a knobhead arent i

Right, got my head straight.
What would you expect to get out of going to the party - what sort of closure do you want to get?
have just discussed this with my husband, and i said that i think i wanted to change peoples opinions of me, theres another girl going as well who i used to be best friends with, i saved her from a bully when we were 13 and we were very very close until we were 22, and then she just stopped taking my calls and i never knew why. Her (N) and K are 2 of the unanswered questions of my past that still upset me. My husband quite rightly pointed out that i wouldnt know what their opinions of me were, and if id been successful if i go to the party, but i then thought i would be happy if i could present myself in a way with which im happy at the party. And that would be my closure.
So i think im gonna go. I cant drink and i would not be hurt if i failed, id just walk away and know the door had closed. Im very good at not caring once its too late - so nothing to lose and i have something to gain.
Thanks angie and dyno for your very, very kind and soothing words. you may both approach me with an offer of formal friendship xx

Why shouldn't you go? As Ange said, teenage girls can be a bit nasty, she's grown up now (possibly) If not, you don't have to be bosom buddies with her anyway. I can well understand your wariness of people, once bitten, twice shy......but as long as it doesn't upset you (or the bump) go along and suss them out, drag hubby for back up? Hope you're keeping well, and not doing too much and taking proper care of yourself, or Auntie Honey will have to come over there to tell you off (LOL) xxxxx

Nates, no time to post, but x.
I'm thinking about it today and will get back to you later.

I think it is easy to get 'stuck' in being a person you used to be when it comes to freindships. Maybe there is an element of that here, in that despite being older wiser etc, it is hard not to feel like that person you were when you knew this girl. It has been a long time, and maybe without anything to cloud your judgement i.e. alcolohol, you will be able to see things in a clear headed way, and see things from an unemotional standpoint, with all the years that have passed? I think this would be quite good for someone, to be able to see people who hurt them.who evoke bad memories, and be able to get closure, even if they are still the same person they were when you knew them. However - and it is a big however, I would ONLY contemplate this if you are sure seeing her wont upset you, as this would make you feel worse. I would seriously consider going though, I'm sure after all these years it will all be fine.x

Just to add that I encountered that sort of behaviour in teenage years too. It is common with teenage girls, so you weren't unusual at all. Like you, I haven't had a smooth ride with adult friendships either. In several friendships I've found that I don't get anything near what I put in. I tend to be a caring friend (not in a bunny boiler way), so if a friend has a problem, I put myself out to be there for them, but this has repeatedly not been reciprocated. I do have friends, but I tend to keep the relationships lighter and more distant these days.

If you go to the party, I hope it goes well. Will you be taking your husband with you?

Hi Honey Honey, yes i see your point, i think if i go, i have to go without husband - so N and I have said we will go together, but N and I havent seen each other since things went weird between us when i was 23
Im back to undecided this morning. I just spoke to my boss about it, i know him from back home and hes going to the party, and he told me theres a couple of other things, theres a girl going called C, i was very close to her sister A at school.
A was abused by her father, C wasnt. It broke the family up and I hid A in my room for a week with no one knowing where she was when it all kicked off. C is now an alcoholic and last time i saw her in 2005, she was very bitter - she blames A for the break up of the family. Ive mentioned this on here before, C was very drunk at A's wedding, and started to have a pop at me. Snidey comments evolved into her saying to my husband: "sorry to shatter your illusions if you think Nato is some sort of princess" - this carried on all night until someone said to me 'whats her problem with you'.. at that point i left. It was awful, we were in our mid 30's and another girl there was telling my husband how i could have had any man i wanted when i was a teenager, and then said 'except Owen' - argghh - it was just so humiliating, me and husband were sat there, while everyone discussed me. But now, i wouldnt sit there and take it - i was shocked into inertia at the time.
I do think theres a bit of jealousy there, i left this small Lancashire town and moved to London, got a job on glossy womens magazine and came back with my very gorgeous husband, this set of girls are problem drinkers who hate their husbands and work on farms - not that theres owt wrong with farms, but they hate it - many comments were made about how ill and skinny i looked (im a size 10, not a size 0)
A year or so later, C friended me on FB, and i rejected her friend request and I told her what i thought of her and told her never to contact me again.
Shes going to be there. Go me.
It gets even worse, C and A's mum is going too, and she doesnt like me either - i am starting to feel a bit embarrassed by this, but their mum disliked my mum, she got drunk and told A that my mum used to be a prostitute and implied that i was a product of one of her client liasons.
It is me isnt it, no one else has this stuff with their childhood friends, do they? its no wonder i shy away from getting close to women. Im bloody well scared of them.
Lizzie, thanks for your post, you are very much right, and i want to wipe all this stuff clean and show them that i wont be that person any more. I want to show K and N that we are all older and this stuff is in the past, C and M i can just ignore cos i dont really care about them anyway, if they try it on again i will just tell them to stop making fools of themselves...but there's an awful lot that could happen if i go, but it seems a pretty intimidating situation to walk into.
Theres so much from my past that is still affecting me after all these friendships have been so difficult for me. I do feel i have something to prove, but am i strong enough to prove it and to achieve what i want to achieve? which is to not be a victim to their projection of their problems onto me. I felt rejected by everyone, and if they reject me again, will that be the end of me wondering about it
i think the bottom line is whether i am strong enough, i honestly dont know if i will be until i am in the lions den. I feel i need to do this though, because of how i feel about friendships now, and i do feel lonely by rejecting the offers of friendship i get now. I feel out of place, like the only way that i will feel i belong is by wiping the past away and undoing their opinions of me.
Thankfully, there are a lot of men going who i have stayed good mates with, and i can always hide behind them. Right, im gonna go. Bout time i rattled the skeletons.

Crikey Nates... lots of stuff to think through - have to work now but will be thi8nking of something hopefully constructive to post for ya later.

Ony thing I woudl say tight now, is party is two weeks away - dobn't amke a decision until you have to.

Speak (post) soon sweetie xx

Thanks stella, its tough trying to work out what you should expect back from friends, and what a healthy dynamic is. I used to have similar feelings to you, and i tried to look at it as though i put in what i wanted to put in, but then when you need some support back, its awful when you realise that you are pretty much alone in the world. Thats why hb is good, i feel that i get a lot back from this place, shame i cant translate it to real friendships. I now am so withdrawn from other people, i actually dont expect any support at all and have done exactly what you have done, keep it lighter and at arms length. That causes problems in itself because we are supposed to have friendships, its how we are built.
i just dont think i understand friendships - i dont really understand what i am supposed to do, or what i am supposed to expect so its easier to expect nothing. Im sorry you feel you have to do that to protect yourself. I hope you have some forms of support, even if its only us here.
Thanks for your thoughts kitty x

Oh, one other thing my sweet:

i just dont understand how to keep friends happy, how to not be pushed around or not to just fail at being a friend.

Is this really the case NOW? Or has it actually been the case previously and you are stuck in that moment? I admit I only know you through your posting but I would say, hand on heart, that I don't think the above sentence applies to you.

Your self awareness makes the sentence seem redundant in the person you are right now , at this point in time, which is not the same person you were during those poor quality friendships/difficult times.

God Nates, I keep saying this but so much of what you write is like some sort of script from my own life.
This weekend right, I spent the entire time on my own (sob sob) and no one sent me a text or called me. I have one friend and I've known her since uni and she treats me like some sort of oddity. She loves me, and I know that, and i love her, but it's like I'm odd and I'm not like her other friends.
She tells me that i'm mad but she loves me for it.
I don't like feeling odd in an an isolated kinda way.
I've really gone off social things because my self esteem isn't good at all and actually, i think i may be getting worse as i get older!
I'm seeing a therapist atm because I realised that there's no time I'm actually comfortable being anywhere. It's vile.
Anyway my love, at school I had one friend, and at uni I had the same two mates all the way through. I shy away from having loads of mates because my head gets overwhelmed and I'm not very good at keeping in touch, or agreeing to do things in advance because it usually means letting people down and that doesn't make me feel good. But it also doesn't make me feel good to go out when I don't want to. Waffle waffle.
I'm myself with Kate my mate, and my sister, but there really isn't anyone else anymore.
And I'm another one who thinks that teenage girls are a nightmare and can be utterly vile to each other. in fact, some of the grown-up women I know of are. I don't like bitchiness and I really don't feel comfortable being with people I'm not sure of.
I don't think you're odd by the way. I think you're probaby a little unsure of yourself sometimes, but most good natured, considerate folk are.

Ok, have thought about this and want to add:

Teenage girls

Horrible things mostly, always a lot of subtexts to their friendships, almost sibling-like rivalry, intense emotions. Not out of malice, but because that's just the way they are. Am reading about it a bit at the moment as my son in turning 15 and feeling very misunderstood. Your teens are when you get to try out your responses to situations, and do get it wrong - inappropriate emotions like jealousy rasie their heads and teens are not emotionally mature enough to process them properly. Your teens are a "training ground" for being an adult, and beginning to understand how the relationship dyamic works.

I had similar experiences at school with my group of "friends" - some of them were quite vile really - getting me drunk and plastering my hair with cat food and taking photos "for a laugh" springs to mind.

My point (and the other posters too) is that bad experiences with school friends are mostly the norm - nothing to beat yourself up with there Nates.

Adult friendships

You say that you have two best friends. This shows that you are capable of adult friendships. I think it may not be true for you to say that you don't have friends, because you do - maybe it's just not as many as you would like, which is a different kettle of fish. Think quality not quantity.

Some "friendships" are meant to be just loose accquaintances, and that is how it is. There are very few people I feel totally "at home" with.

Expectations

You feel let down by previous friendships - you are very self aware Nates, do you think you can let this go? My friends often don't meet my expectations, and I'm sure that I am not the person the want me to be all of the time! And do you know what, it doesn't matter - they are still my friends.
The Party

This one is about choices:

Dont go - leave the past where it is, recognise that these folk were difficult to be around and that having them around again would be a waste of emotional energy and don't look back.

Go - with the objective of building bridges to create adult relationships with X Y and Z. Think about the benefits this would bring you e.g. having people in your life who "knew you when..." some continuity etc.

Go - with the objective of showing face and leaving things on an amicable footing - lay ghosts to rest so to speak, and then move on.

Go - with the objective of showing them how fab you are now - kick sand in their faces and then move on.

I'm certain you'll make the right decision for you.

Hope this helps xx